An example of batik design based on Hafiz’s Sarawakian root (Photo credit: Hafiz Drahman/Tradneo)

Hafiz Drahman, is the face behind Tradneo, a brand forwarding contemporary motif based on personal memories and identities. With his Sarawakian blood, he creates design that reflect this identity and to experiment various surface design technique. He is currently pursuing his PhD at University Putra Malaysia exploring batik technology as well as to inspire the new generation designers to get acquainted with their roots through textile design.

In this episode of aNERDspective (our NERD talk show where we converse with amazing friends about their textile adventure and perspectives), we talked to Hafiz about his story on how he  fell in love with batik and his process in developing batik with Sarawakian motif.

Note: The transcript has been edited for reading format.

Tony Sugiarta: Welcome Hafiz to today’s episode of aNERDspective. How are you doing there in Kelantan?

Hafiz Drahman: Alhamdulillah, I am doing great here. There is an MCO (Movement Control Order), so I just need to survive during this MCO.

Is it recently extended again?

In Kelantan, we are currently going towards Phase II. So, maybe after this, they will lift up the MCO, but I think in Kuala Lumpur, in Selangor, (they are) still under strict MCO.

Not to worry, let’s talk about something fun. I got to know Hafiz through our previous guest, Syahida. She recommended you and I take a look at your portfolios and I am super interested in your Sarawak batik motif and we will be talking more about that.

But first of all, maybe you will be able to share a little bit about yourself, your journey, and leading up to developing this batik.

First of all, thank you for inviting me to share my experience with the audience.

Hi everyone, my name is Hafiz Drahman. I am currently based in Kelantan. I am from Kuala Lumpur actually. I am 35 years old. I graduated from UiTM (Universiti Teknologi MARA), my diploma and my degree was in graphic design, but later on when I did my master I changed to another major which is design technology with focus on batik. I have always been fascinated by batik Malaysia or batik Indonesia, from all over the world.

When did you first get in touch with batik? What are your earliest memories about batik?

Honestly, I think it started when I was young, I cannot remember when but I have this picture of me lying on a beautiful batik pillow. So, basically my parents already applied this (ed.: using batik around the house), not intentionally, because they are not designers as well but they really love those products. Since I was small, because I always look at the pillow itself, that makes me appreciate batik more, especially by looking at old pictures during my younger years.

I think one who inspired me to go to this batik industry was my uncle. He is a batik artist, but unfortunately he passed away a few years back. It started when I was small. I really love the arts. So, during my school, we have a small batik kit and it has a basic introduction on batik. Professionally, I think when I did my degree, that was in 2006 or 2007, during an elective class, we started to use canting, to explore the batik process. I did a small project for my mom – I do some scarves, basically just for my mom and that gives me confidence to sell the batik. You need to practice and produce beautiful motifs. I am not very good at canting, it is quite tough. By looking at those people who are producing canting fabrics, for example in Indonesia, who hold the fabric and do the canting process slowly. I do not have that passion to canting it slowly. I prefer using the block.

Why I changed my major from graphic to textile, it is because of my passion and love of batik. I really love the pattern that we can see on batik. It is quite similar to graphic design, but in graphic design we normally do more on corporate design, like designing logos is one of the processes that I have been doing since my diploma. So, for me, when I look into a motif, it is like a logo. It is a stylized element of art and principle of design. From that, I started to explore more batik.

When I did my degree, there was an elective subject. They ask you which elective you would like to continue and there is batik elective, so right away I just choose that for my elective. From there, I started to build up more passion and explore more about batik.

When I did my Master’s, I did research on batik design. Right after I did my Master’s, I started to produce a little bit of batik fabric which uses the batik block technique. In Malaysia, we have several techniques, like canting, silkscreen and batik block. Within these three techniques, I noticed that the batik block really inspired me to continue my endeavour in this textile industry. From there, I started to explore more. I went to Kelantan, Terengganu, just to look at the traditional ways of using batik blocks. Then I did a lot of experimentation, developing my own tools, and decided to explore using alternative materials, like using cutboards, pieces of dried wood, or anything that has the potential of producing some textures using the wax. I just experiment.

How is the experiment going?

It is good, I mean, of course if we compare it to a traditional block, it is more steady. The challenge of using recycled material is that it cannot produce the exact quality when you use metal. For me, it is not a problem because I love to have some abstract texture on my batik fabric. For example, I even use the peanut shell. Eventually after a few times of dipping in the wax, it starts to turn brittle because it is a natural material. But it is okay, I just repair it with the new peanut shells. For me, it is fine, but for others they expect to use metal. That is what I did in my Master’s studies and I continued (exploring) the batik block process since.

So, do you learn how to make the block yourself, the copper block?

I know the process but it is quite tedious. I just ask my friends (ed.: local block makers) to do it for me.

How many stamp makers are there now in Kelantan?

For the stamp makers, I think at the moment we have less than 10, compared to the previous years.

Less than 10, are they young or are they old?

I think we have two or three young ones, the rest are veteran batik stamp makers. We learn that number, if we look at the young batik stamp makers, maybe only one who can produce a good quality block which is similar to Indonesian quality in terms of the even surface of the batik block and the steadiness of the block itself. Not everyone has the passion to do intricate metal and to do the block itself. It is very hard.

Why Batik Sarawak? Because my father is from Sarawak. So, my father is from Sarawak and my mum is from Johor. When I started to develop more techniques, one of the lecturers asked me about what is unique and what do you want to share with the audience in batik design. Currently, we have a lot of batik designers in Malaysia and in order to move forward, (we need to) stand out from the others.

I did a little bit of research and I have one local designer who is from Sarawak, her name is Dato’ Tom Abang Saufi. I really love her design and I even bought some of her batik. From there, I decided to incorporate the Sarawakian motif in my design because I really want to share my heritage with the audience. My kampung (village) is in Nyah, Miri. We have a lot of beautiful jungles and forests. From there, I started to look at the traditional artefact or kain Pua Kumbih and anything related with Sarawak’s heritage.

As for my process of designing the motif, I do not copy the traditional motif (as is) because as a designer, we need to respect the traditional motif. So, I do a lot of stylisation and design a new motif, but still inspired by Sarawak’s heritage. It is more contemporary when compared to the traditional look and style. I am still actively participating in the local batik industry. But since working in the university, I have to divide my time with lecturing. Any free time that I have, I will experiment with the colours and techniques.

It seems that your perspective as an artist and a designer is more open minded to experiment?

Yes, to experiment you have to be open minded. If you are not open minded, then you will be stressed because experimentation is important for us to learn. The objective is to learn and to discover the effect of using alternative materials. If you are not open minded, it’s ok, just use metal. You do not need to be sad if it is not working using alternative material.

Talking about the design of your Batik Sarawak motif. First of all, is there batik wax resist culture in Sarawak?

Yeah, we do have batik wax resist culture, but compared to Kelantan and Terengganu, it is quite new in Sarawak. The most famous fabric is woven textile, like Pua Kumbu and Songket. Batik is quite new in Sarawak. It started with canting and then they started to explore with batik blocks, and the silkscreen industry. It is quite hard to produce batik in Sarawak because all the materials are imported from China. So, I think most of it will be sold to Kelantan or Terengganu or Kuala Lumpur. Then, later on they will export it to Sarawak. The cost of delivering all of these materials is very expensive. So, not many batik makers are willing to do batik. We have several workshops, but mainly in Kelantan, Terengganu, and Kuala Lumpur.

To do experiment you have to be open minded. The objective is to learn and to discover the effect of using alternative materials.

I would say that the motif exploration is also pretty new as well and it is a reflection and inspired by the woven cloth?

Yes, I agree with that. Most of the motifs are derived from the artefacts or products that they produce in their lifestyle, like Pua Kumbu’s colourful bits. For example, for Dato’ Tom Abang Saufi, she is still inspired by those products but she tried to make it more contemporary by applying different sets of colour that are not so traditional but very bright colours. The motif itself is stylised according to her philosophy. It is not 100% derived from the product, but they will do some stylisation to make it more contemporary.

How about you? How do you approach your design? If you can take us on that creative journey, from research to doing your design.

I think we need more than five hours, is it okay?

Sure. *laughter*

We need to follow some steps that we learn from art college.

Being a graphic designer, first of all, I will start by thinking what are the final products that I want to produce. I will look at the final product first.

For example, I want to launch a new men’s wear collection. From there, I will do some visual reference. It is to find out what motif that I can design and apply on my batik. Those references could be derived from books or gallery visits. Pretty much looking back from my treasured trunk of ideas. I like to take photos, so I look at the photos and then we will go into other sources of inspiration by looking at other designer’s points of view. Maybe they are not doing batik, but the motif that they use on their textile or fashion design could also attract my attention and be part of my inspiration. First of all, of course, the visual reference.

Once I think I have enough good sources of references,  I will look at the lines, colours, arrangement of the motif, which will be used in the men’s wear collection. Then, I will start to draw. Normally I will do several sketches for the motifs, just using pen and paper. I am very traditional. Some of my friends are using iPad. I am looking forward to using more technology in my process. I do a lot of drawing using my pen and papers, then I will keep on developing or stylising the motif until I feel the motif has a good potential. It is similar to designing a logo. I will do a lot of sketches.

The subject matter itself, for example, if I am inspired by a flower, I would try to not copy exactly all the elements or the shape of the flower. I will stylise it, just like what I did in my logo design, just to make it more interesting. You can use the exact shape, but it is going to be boring. You need to be different from others. After that process of sketching, I will scan everything and put it on my laptop. It is much faster compared with using a traditional way of doing a layout manually using pencils.

In the lecture, I normally use AI (Adobe Illustrator) to speed up the process of designing. Once I already have the shape of the motif, the colour, and so on, we just experimented in AI until I achieved the design that I desire, something that has a market value. Because in designing motifs, you can do a lot of style but at the end, your customer or your client (need to) love the design. It can go beyond your creativity or imagination, but at the end, you need to sell the product. So, that is why there are a lot of visual references from other designers.

Nice, you have laid out the designer’s journey, which a lot of it is customer focused – coming from the customers, what they might like, how you sell to them, what is the product going to be. It comes from there (ed.: the customer) as a starting point. How about incorporating philosophy of the traditional motif? How do you input it into the design, if any?

To answer that question, I think that will be in the process of designing the motif. Normally, in the fashion part, I like to do something that is sellable, not very couture and not very heavy for our locals to purchase.

When I do the design, especially designing a motif, from what I have learnt from my experience, I have started to have some philosophies or my own DNA in batik design. Every time I launch a new batik, they will know that it is Hafiz Drahman’s batik.

Some of the key elements that I apply to my design, first of all, of course, the Sarawak look. The motif is inspired by Sarawak. It is easy, when you look at the motif of sarawak, the traditional style will be, for example, the orang hulu motif which has wavy lines. In my design, maybe I do not have much wave lines but as I said earlier, I do a lot of stylisation. The wave lines I will change or stylise using bold lines because I love to use bold lines in my design. That is one of my DNA in designing batik motifs.

Besides using bold lines, I love to use vibrant colours in my design because it is just my preference in designing batik. We can apply a lot of other colours, but my DNA in designing batik motifs is having vibrant and contrasting colours.

Some of the philosophies that I apply are something about the stories behind the motif. For example, when I did my 2017 collection, which is for a batik competition in Malaysia, called Piala Seri Endon. That motif was inspired by a traditional kue (cake) in Sarawak, called kue lempok durian. The packaging of that kue has inspired me to create a motif for that collection. So from the packaging design, I turn it into a motif. That is what I meant that there is a story behind the subject matter. It is not just a typical kind of motif that you obtain from the forest or from the jungle or any kind of plants.

In my process, it must start from something that you have history with or something that you love. Then the process of designing is going to be smooth because you love the subject matter, you have some history about the subject matter, so it is easier for you to understand about the subject matter and the process of designing. It is hard when you do not love the subject matter and you try to push yourself to design something that you are not keen and do not love. You must love your subject matter. From my experience, if you cry when thinking about the subject matter, you better use that as your designs. That is where you transfer your soul into your design. That is what I have been practicing when designing my batik motif. So every batik motif that I design, there is a story.

You must love your subject matter. That is where you transfer your soul into your design.

So it is not just about traditional looks but also use that as a visual reference and then you add your personal touch and with your personal memories as well.

What are some of the challenges that you face while running Tradneo or doing your designs?

There are a lot of challenges. First of all, I think that trying to be consistent and relevant in the industry is very challenging, especially during a pandemic situation. As a designer, we look at pretty much all sorts of activities in this world. So during this pandemic, it affects our emotions. If you look at my design currently, it is very sad in terms of colour and shapes. It reminds me a lot of those people who are affected and also passed away due to COVID. It really affects my emotions. At the same time, I try to focus more on the good things, especially my family.

During this pandemic situation, it is very hard to get all those raw materials. Even though there are a few shops still selling it, the price itself is very expensive so I cannot buy all those materials at the moment. Maybe I need to use other alternative materials, but in terms of colour and fabrics, there is nothing much you can do. We definitely need to buy those things because those are the main items in doing batik.

To attract the young generation to use batik in their lifestyle is quite tough because the cost of producing batik for SME is very high so we cannot sell it at a low price at the moment. There is a way to attract them but we need to be united. All those batik designers, local batik sellers need to be united and from there, we can move forward easily. So those are some of the challenges that I have experienced during this situation. Just to sustain these traditional processes, industries need a lot of support from the community and, of course, money. Money is important for us to buy the materials. Just passion and loving the batik is not enough. We need to have a small capital to continue the project. I am lucky because I am attached to one of the local universities so the extra money that I have I can use it to create a small (batch) or support other batik stamp makers, just to make sure this legacy keep on evolving, (there is) a new innovation and so forth, by applying those research that I have done for past few years, share with them, especially on designing the motif, the colours and so forth.

You mentioned earlier that during this period there are more people buying the printed materials as opposed to the traditional batik, is there any chance to switch them to buy the (cloth made by) traditional technique?

During this pandemic situation, a lot of people are trying to save more of their money by buying essential items. So, at the moment, for our local industry, the cost of producing batik is very high. We try to make it affordable for everyone. I think we should produce something which is saleable, cheaper, and the process that does not use a lot of wax. We need to use a little amount of wax because the cost is very expensive and if we use a lot of raw materials then the prices will go up and the cost of production will grow. So, we (need to) produce something saleable and we also introduced to them those items

At the same time, I think that it is not a priority for most of them to buy because during this situation every Ringgit is very precious and they opt for something cheaper, still nice to wear during this situation but something which is not too expensive. Most of them allocated their budget for buying batik at 50 Ringgit (~16SGD, 12USD) and below, not more than that. There are some who spend more than a hundred but not many will do that because in this situation a hundred Ringgit is quite a lot. You can last for maybe one week or maybe two weeks (with that amount of money). So we also promote those items. There are a few who will buy but most of them will opt for the digital print because it is cheaper.

Definitely understand in times like this situation and priorities where people will spend their money. So it is totally understandable.

Another thing is that there are not many events going on. So everyone is staying at home. They only wear whatever that they have, there is no reason to do OOTD. There are a few who will do OOTD at home but not many will have the chance to do that. Everyone is affected, especially emotionally.

What are some of the projects or things that you are currently doing? What’s upcoming from Hafiz Drahman?

This is what I have been waiting for you to ask.

Currently my friends and I are going to launch a new batik collection. It is supposed to be an annual (launch) event. Last year we had a fashion week but nobody watched the fashion week because everybody is concerned about safety and health.

This year, one of the batik organisation approached us, so we will come up with a new collection, which is something that is unique, sellable and affordable for everyone. We are currently producing prototypes for the photoshoot and maybe, according to them, will launch the video of the digital show sometime in September.

For my collection, I do not use a very intricate motif. For the motif that you saw just now, I used recycled woods. I got it from a local carpenter. I just use that and apply it to my batik process because I still have some of the colour powders and so forth. The collection is going to look very modern, very contemporary. It is something for us to celebrate as a human being and we need to stay together (in such times like the pandemic). So the collection is to uplift your spirits. The colours that I use in my batik design are vibrant. So, do not worry too much about the COVID. So I just go and celebrate. Some of my friends are designing new things as well. The launch is scheduled for September.

We are looking forward to that.

I will share the video and the content very soon.

You mentioned that you do teach as a lecturer as well, so that keeps you busy? Are you pursuing a PhD?

Yes, (I am) pursuing PhD and then teaching classes and doing my batik, so I am a very busy man. And since MCO, I started to explore planting and I focus on caladiums. For me, the caladiums look like batik. The motif or the design on the leaf is like a batik painting. I do a lot of planting as well. So yeah, I am currently pursuing my PhD and doing research on the batik block. It is progressing well but it is quite tough at the moment to go to interview some of them. Some of them are very busy with their activities so I need to find the right time to meet all these people and get all the data.

Also are you researching the technology of batik stamps?

Correct. Currently we are facing problems with the declining number of buyers buying local batik so I need to find out what the reason is – is it because of the design? So it is exploring or researching the quality of our local batik. We need to share it with the batik industries so that they can implement or come up with a proper plan for them to revive or to innovate batik industries.

You mentioned earlier about attracting a younger audience, how are responses from your students? And what are some of the opportunities in order to attract them? How can we get these younger generations more involved?

From my observation, for example from my students, they are skewed more towards something that is contemporary. They are the generation that love something out of the box and they do not like “traditional things”. Even they themselves are confused of the real batik versus the digital textile. Sometimes for digital textile, they thought that it is batik. The true meaning of batik is using wax in the process of making it. So the digital cloth could be inspired by the batik motif but it is not the real batik.

So that is one of the challenges, we need to constantly remind them what is the real or true meaning of batik. That is what is happening in Malaysia. In terms of design, they like something contemporary. Then looking at the market segmentation, the younger generation prefer something new, something that is contemporary as well. It is not that they do not like the traditional, it is just that we can use back the traditional motif but maybe we need to stylize a little bit in terms of the layout that is not too crowded. Sometimes they want a less crowded design. So we have to constantly ask the audience what they want or what they prefer when buying batik.

Another thing is the price itself. The younger generation do not have much pocket money to buy all these beautiful batik. So we have to make sure that the products that we sell for the younger segment are not too expensive and are not too crowded (in the patterns).

I think there is a lot of potential in how to attract them. As you can see, nowadays, there are a lot of interesting technologies and social media. I think we can start collaborating with them, maybe by wearing our collection and posting them on social media so that  it can also attract the other audience, especially the younger ones. It is just that we need to constantly update the design. They like new stuff, they do not like all those 60s or 70s vibe. We have to go beyond the design elements that we normally do. So it is a challenge for the young designers as well to come up with what is new or what is relevant in the batik industry.

Besides collaboration, I think another way we can attract them is by inviting them to create their own batik. So this is the best time for them to experiment and explore making batik by themselves. As you know, at the moment, batik makers are still in MCO so most of the batik workshop is closed due to the pandemic so I am also selling some of my batik kits, especially the tie and dye. That is the simple way for them to learn and to understand how we normally do batik in the industry, even though the industry uses wax. That is an introduction to batik. I think that is one of the interesting ways for them to explore. They can then upload on Tik-Tok or Twitter, sharing their creative products to others.

We need to constantly remind people what is the real or true meaning of batik.

Definitely design evolves, so the motifs need to follow the generations as well. So they have room for exploration and experimentation.

Before we close off our conversation, do you have any final thoughts to sum up our conversation today, your hopes for the future of your brand or textile in general?

I do a lot of planning and hoping, especially in Malaysia, I hope that our batik industry will revive or grow well in the next few years as it is very challenging for us right now. I think the best for us now is to continue the process of making batik. The industry tries to sustain by doing collaboration and to adapt to the current situation. That is the way.

We must stay united, especially the designers, not just in Malaysia, I think the whole world. When we are united, our mind is more focused and we can share our knowledge, exchange advice or learn a new process and technique so that it can uplift our spirits to create more beautiful unique artworks. I hope that the local and international industry can work together in the future

For myself, I would love to share my and my friends’ batik collection to other parts of the world. So I am hoping to bring our local content to the international audience. We have to constantly keep the industry alive by doing this. So that we can inspire others and the new generation will continue the legacy of batik design in the future. That is my hope and I wish for everyone the best in the future.

All right. Thank you so much Hafiz. At this moment, to survive the pandemic, but also in the greater scheme of things, is to promote collaboration and discussion not just within the community, but with the designers or practitioners everywhere to create a more cohesive narrative, as well as community strength in our designs and in the promotion of traditional textile. 

Thank you so much once again for dropping by today.

We hope you enjoyed this episode of aNERDspective. Check out the previous episode on IGTV and our gallery and store if you would like a piece of Indonesia for your home or wardrobe. You may also check out  Tradneo’s Instagram for the latest collection.

Photo credit: Tradneo, unless stated otherwise.